False cognates
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- cuneiform
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Re: False cognates
Arabic: Ard
Dutch: Aard
English: Earth
Dutch: Aard
English: Earth
- KaiTheHomoSapien
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Re: False cognates
I remember seeing that one before. That's a pretty crazy coincidence. I think I just assumed they were related when I first saw it.Wario Toad 32 wrote:Arabic: Ard
Dutch: Aard
English: Earth
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- mayan
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Re: False cognates
元 yuán "yuan (Chinese unit of currency)" - 円 en "yen (Japanese unit of currency)" (formerly pronounced yen)
I thought for the longest time that 円 was the Japanese version of 元. Nope, it's the simplified Japanese version of 圓 (simplified Chinese 圆), also pronounced yuán in Mandarin.
I thought for the longest time that 円 was the Japanese version of 元. Nope, it's the simplified Japanese version of 圓 (simplified Chinese 圆), also pronounced yuán in Mandarin.
Re: False cognates
Character use and simplification strategies may have diverged here, but the words themselves (yuán/yen) are cognates.GrandPiano wrote: 元 yuán "yuan (Chinese unit of currency)" - 円 en "yen (Japanese unit of currency)" (formerly pronounced yen)
I thought for the longest time that 円 was the Japanese version of 元. Nope, it's the simplified Japanese version of 圓 (simplified Chinese 圆), also pronounced yuán in Mandarin.
The Papa Bear to all of these (also, Korean "won") is 圓, "round". In the Sinosphere, 元 appears in various monetary contexts (including the 1-yuan coin here on the mainland), but on banknotes, 圓 is still used in Taiwan, 圆 on the mainland, and both 圓 and 元 on paper bills in Hong Kong (though I have no idea what's in use there now).
As to why 元 didn't make the cut for currency use in Japan, I can only guess that its onyomi readings "gan" and "gen" homonymously disqualified it from "yen → en" (and it seems to be used more in its sense of "primary, principal" anyway). Meanwhile, 円 in its sense of "round" also pops up in its kunyomi reading "marui" (円い). Being more familiar with marui written as 丸い, I just assumed 円い was merely a variant, perhaps older form. But according to the Tangorin online dictionary: "丸い usu. refers to ball-shaped, and 円い to disc-shaped objects", which is a kinda neat factoid I did not know before (and makes sense from a kanji point of view). Clawgrip or Des can attest as to whether that's prescriptivist wishful thinking or actual usage on the ground. That distinction certainly was not on my radar during Lao Kou: The Japan Years, yet frankly, despite my ignorance in this, I remain skeptical as to how strictly this is enforced/maintained.
☯ 道可道,非常道
☯ 名可名,非常名
☯ 名可名,非常名
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- mayan
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Re: False cognates
Interesting. I suspected such, and I was mainly referring to the characters' etymologies, but it's interesting to have confirmation that the words themselves are etymologically related.
- k1234567890y
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Re: False cognates
Turkish ordu "army" and English order
I prefer to not be referred to with masculine pronouns and nouns such as “he/him/his”.
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- cuneiform
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Re: False cognates
groseille (from Middle Dutch kroesels; ultimately from PIE *gʰer-) ~ gradile (from Old Norse gaddr; ultimately from PIE *g̑hasto-), both meaning currant
ETA:
timah 'tin' (from Proto-Western Malayo-Polynesian *timəʀaq) ~ tin
ETA:
timah 'tin' (from Proto-Western Malayo-Polynesian *timəʀaq) ~ tin
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- mayan
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Re: False cognates
agō "I do" - hago /ˈago/ "I do"
( hago actually comes from faciō, also meaning "I do")
( hago actually comes from faciō, also meaning "I do")
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- cuneiform
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Re: False cognates
And all this time I thought Emoji was a Japanazation of "emotion"protondonor wrote: emoticon ~ emoji
Many children make up, or begin to make up, imaginary languages. I have been at it since I could write.
-JRR Tolkien
-JRR Tolkien
Re: False cognates
Well, I would've guessed that the ji was 字 'character', but yeah, that emo- part not being related to emoti(c)on is pretty surprising. Appears to be true, though.Shemtov wrote:And all this time I thought Emoji was a Japanazation of "emotion"protondonor wrote: emoticon ~ emoji
Re: False cognates
I completely agree with this.Xonen wrote: but yeah, that emo- part not being related to emoti(c)on is pretty surprising.
Another false cognate:
Finnish kirjekuori < kirje 'letter' + kuori 'shale, skin, shell, cover, etc.'
Swedish kuvert /kɵˈvæːr/ < Fr. couvert 'covered'
Both meaning envelope. For some reason I was initially certain that the kuori part was a Swedish loan, before recognizing it in kovakuoriainen 'beetle' < kova 'hard' + kuori + -iainen 'nominalizer'
Re: False cognates
Weird, it never even occurred to me that emoji might be perceived of as being related to emotion until just now. 絵文字 e-moji. And with "emoticon" sitting right there suggesting a connection.
This is legit. The actual word for "disc" is 円盤, unless you mean a computer disk, in which it's ディスク (I include this English loanword just to bother you). But it's analagous to disc vs. disk, at least in my usage.Lao Kou wrote:丸い usu. refers to ball-shaped, and 円い to disc-shaped objects[/i]", which is a kinda neat factoid I did not know before (and makes sense from a kanji point of view). Clawgrip or Des can attest as to whether that's prescriptivist wishful thinking or actual usage on the ground.
Re: False cognates
Mission accomplished.clawgrip wrote:ディスク (I include this English loanword just to bother you).
☯ 道可道,非常道
☯ 名可名,非常名
☯ 名可名,非常名
Re: False cognates
I think if you know how to read Kanji, and have encountered the Kanji for Emoji, the "connection" might not be that obvious.clawgrip wrote:Weird, it never even occurred to me that emoji might be perceived of as being related to emotion until just now. 絵文字 e-moji. And with "emoticon" sitting right there suggesting a connection.
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I do wonder if Japanese people know the word "emoticon", and that influenced them to narrow the meaning of "絵文字" from "pictograph" to, well "emoji".
Many children make up, or begin to make up, imaginary languages. I have been at it since I could write.
-JRR Tolkien
-JRR Tolkien
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- mayan
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Re: False cognates
soso "dull" - so-so
Re: False cognates
Similarly:GrandPiano wrote: soso "dull" - so-so
まあまあ māmā "so-so"
馬馬虎虎 mǎmǎhūhū "so-so"
Re: False cognates
What kind of magical fun park is China if a bunch of horses and tigers is just so-so?
Re: False cognates
There is a story. There's always a story :
In the Song Dynasty, there was a painter who liked to paint anything he felt like painting. Most people could not understand his paintings.
One day, when he had just finished a painting of a tiger's head, his friend came to ask him for a painting of a horse. So, he painted a horse's body behind the tiger's head. His friend asked him if the painting was of a tiger or a horse. He answered, "马马虎虎 (mǎmǎhuhu) horse and tiger". His friend rejected his painting, so he put it up in his living room.
His eldest son asked him, "What's that in the painting?" He answered, "A tiger." However, when his younger son asked him he answered, "A horse."
Shortly after this, his eldest son while hunting shot someone’s horse because he thought it was a tiger. The painter had to pay the owner of the horse a lot of money. His second son went out and saw a tiger and he wanted to ride it because he thought it was a horse. But, when the boy tried to ride the tiger it killed him.
The painter was very sad, so he burned the painting. Then he wrote a poem: "Horse-tiger painting; horse-tiger painting; my eldest son shot a horse because of the picture, my second son was killed because of the picture. The picture has been burned in my cottage. Hope other people will not make the same mistake as me."
马虎 (mǎhu) careless
马马虎虎 (mǎmǎhuhu) just so so
In the Song Dynasty, there was a painter who liked to paint anything he felt like painting. Most people could not understand his paintings.
One day, when he had just finished a painting of a tiger's head, his friend came to ask him for a painting of a horse. So, he painted a horse's body behind the tiger's head. His friend asked him if the painting was of a tiger or a horse. He answered, "马马虎虎 (mǎmǎhuhu) horse and tiger". His friend rejected his painting, so he put it up in his living room.
His eldest son asked him, "What's that in the painting?" He answered, "A tiger." However, when his younger son asked him he answered, "A horse."
Shortly after this, his eldest son while hunting shot someone’s horse because he thought it was a tiger. The painter had to pay the owner of the horse a lot of money. His second son went out and saw a tiger and he wanted to ride it because he thought it was a horse. But, when the boy tried to ride the tiger it killed him.
The painter was very sad, so he burned the painting. Then he wrote a poem: "Horse-tiger painting; horse-tiger painting; my eldest son shot a horse because of the picture, my second son was killed because of the picture. The picture has been burned in my cottage. Hope other people will not make the same mistake as me."
马虎 (mǎhu) careless
马马虎虎 (mǎmǎhuhu) just so so
☯ 道可道,非常道
☯ 名可名,非常名
☯ 名可名,非常名