(L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here [2010-2019]

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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by shimobaatar »

DesEsseintes wrote:
Creyeditor wrote:That's the rank. You can call him qwed.
[xD]

I thought he was thanking the Mongolian language and I could not figure out why!
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by qwed117 »

shimobaatar wrote:
DesEsseintes wrote:
Creyeditor wrote:That's the rank. You can call him qwed.
[xD]

I thought he was thanking the Mongolian language and I could not figure out why!
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Dormouse559 »

DesEsseintes wrote:I thought he was thanking the Mongolian language and I could not figure out why!
You know you're a conlanger when …
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Frislander »

qwed117 wrote:
shimobaatar wrote:
DesEsseintes wrote:
Creyeditor wrote:That's the rank. You can call him qwed.
[xD]

I thought he was thanking the Mongolian language and I could not figure out why!
[+1]
*pillages your village and takes over your empire*
He is still young, he will yet learn.
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Ælfwine »

Why do some Eastern Romance (like Istriot) have -ei as their plural? (as opposed to just -i)

Also, I'm trying to look up toponyms around Lake Batalon in Hungary to give me clues on sound shifts in Pannonian Romance. Do any of these names look like they could derive from Latin?

Siófok
Tihany
Zamárdi
Marcali
Fonyód
Szigliget
Tapolca
Last edited by Ælfwine on 25 Sep 2017 03:20, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by shimobaatar »

Ælfwine wrote:Also, I'm trying to look up toponyms around Lake Batalon in Hungary to give me clues on sound shifts in Pannonian Romance. Do any of these names look like they could derive from Latin?

Siófok
Tihany
Zamárdi
Marcali
Fonyód
Szigliget
Tapolca
Are you asking for particular Latin words these names could come from, or are you just asking if any of them sound like they potentially could be derived from Latin? If it's the latter, "Marcali", "Tapolca", and "Zamárdi" sound particularly Latinate to me, but of course, any of these could theoretically be derived from Latin with the right sound changes.
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Ælfwine »

shimobaatar wrote:
Ælfwine wrote:Also, I'm trying to look up toponyms around Lake Batalon in Hungary to give me clues on sound shifts in Pannonian Romance. Do any of these names look like they could derive from Latin?

Siófok
Tihany
Zamárdi
Marcali
Fonyód
Szigliget
Tapolca
Are you asking for particular Latin words these names could come from, or are you just asking if any of them sound like they potentially could be derived from Latin? If it's the latter, "Marcali", "Tapolca", and "Zamárdi" sound particularly Latinate to me, but of course, any of these could theoretically be derived from Latin with the right sound changes.
Former if possible, latter if not.
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Salmoneus »

Ælfwine wrote:Why do some Eastern Romance (like Istriot) have -ei as their plural? (as opposed to just -i)

Also, I'm trying to look up toponyms around Lake Batalon in Hungary to give me clues on sound shifts in Pannonian Romance. Do any of these names look like they could derive from Latin?

Siófok
Tihany
Zamárdi
Marcali
Fonyód
Szigliget
Tapolca
Have you talked to Dewrad about this? His romlang is set around Lake Balaton, iirc. Iirc it's more based on Dalmatian (etc) than on historical Pannonian Romance (which may not even have been an Eastern Romance language, historically), but if there's anything concrete known about the latter he probably knows about it.

EDIT: he's not around much, and he may be too busy to help you much, but it would seem worth asking. He might at least point you in the right direction.
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by qwed117 »

Ælfwine wrote:Why do some Eastern Romance (like Istriot) have -ei as their plural? (as opposed to just i)
Probably dissimilation from a prior vowel if it is masculine and from the second declension, or it might be from -ēs if from the 3rd declension
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Ælfwine »

qwed117 wrote:
Ælfwine wrote:Why do some Eastern Romance (like Istriot) have -ei as their plural? (as opposed to just i)
Probably dissimilation from a prior vowel if it is masculine and from the second declension, or it might be from -ēs if from the 3rd declension
The latter seems plausible.
Salmoneus wrote:
Ælfwine wrote:Why do some Eastern Romance (like Istriot) have -ei as their plural? (as opposed to just -i)

Also, I'm trying to look up toponyms around Lake Batalon in Hungary to give me clues on sound shifts in Pannonian Romance. Do any of these names look like they could derive from Latin?

Siófok
Tihany
Zamárdi
Marcali
Fonyód
Szigliget
Tapolca
Have you talked to Dewrad about this? His romlang is set around Lake Balaton, iirc. Iirc it's more based on Dalmatian (etc) than on historical Pannonian Romance (which may not even have been an Eastern Romance language, historically), but if there's anything concrete known about the latter he probably knows about it.

EDIT: he's not around much, and he may be too busy to help you much, but it would seem worth asking. He might at least point you in the right direction.
I have not, but I will.

I took a look at Dravian. There a few things I like about it, but there are many things I dislike. For the most part the language seems too Italianesque for a lack of a better word, and even though I get he focused on Dalmatian as his main influence, I would think there would be a bit more Romanian influence, even if the language was not historically Eastern Romance.

I want to ask him specifically about vowel changes, as currently my vowel shifts from Latin are mostly made up. As soon as I get accepted to the ZBB I'll carry along with that.

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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by All4Ɇn »

Does anyone know what the current estimates are for the number of German speakers in America during its pre-ww1 height?
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Post by qwed117 »

Wikipedia suggests up to 2.8 million, but it only counts foreign born Germans, suggesting the number maybe significantly higher. This is however the beginning time period of the American schooling system, so I'd imagine a good amount of their children were not speaking German, (maybe a third?) If each pair had 3 children, that'd put the rough estimate at nearly 50% higher.
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by All4Ɇn »

qwed117 wrote:Wikipedia suggests up to 2.8 million, but it only counts foreign born Germans, suggesting the number maybe significantly higher. This is however the beginning time period of the American schooling system, so I'd imagine a good amount of their children were not speaking German, (maybe a third?) If each pair had 3 children, that'd put the rough estimate at nearly 50% higher.
Do you know what year that was by chance? I'm curious what percentage of the total population that could be.
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Ashtăr Balynestjăr »

When did Standard German become non-rhotic?
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by qwed117 »

All4Ɇn wrote:
qwed117 wrote:Wikipedia suggests up to 2.8 million, but it only counts foreign born Germans, suggesting the number maybe significantly higher. This is however the beginning time period of the American schooling system, so I'd imagine a good amount of their children were not speaking German, (maybe a third?) If each pair had 3 children, that'd put the rough estimate at nearly 50% higher.
Do you know what year that was by chance? I'm curious what percentage of the total population that could be.
1910 census.
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Post by All4Ɇn »

qwed117 wrote:1910 census.
Hmm so about 3-6%

Ashtăr Balynestjăr wrote:When did Standard German become non-rhotic?
According Renata Szczepaniak, around the end of the 10th century
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Post by Ashtăr Balynestjăr »

All4Ɇn wrote:
Ashtăr Balynestjăr wrote:When did Standard German become non-rhotic?
According Renata Szczepaniak, around the end of the 10th century
Are you implying that Middle High German was non-rhotic? Karl Lepsius and Alexander Ellis both described final /r/ in German as a consonant well into the 19th century, and Japanese transcriptions of German conventionally use ル ru to transcribe final German /r/, whereas ア a is more common when transcribing English. Then again, there is that linking-/r/ in daran, worüber, etc., so maybe the German consonantal /r/ was artificially imposed later on.

Edit: That’s not a linking-/r/, but a reflex of PGmc *r in *þar and *hwar, so that evidence is out. Perhaps that first round of rhotic-dropping was responsible for da and wo... I’d really like to read Szczepaniak’s arguments.
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Creyeditor »

Don't forget that there have been two competing pronunciation standards for German for decades. I think Viëtor might have already been criticizing rhoticity in Sieb's standard German.
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Iyionaku »

How long does it usually take for Children to acquire tone in tonal language? I was always under the impression that it may take several years, but recently I watched a Chinese children TV series and was surprised that even the 3somewhat-year-olds were already (apparently) distinghuishing tone.
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here

Post by Lao Kou »

Iyionaku wrote:How long does it usually take for children to acquire tone in tonal language? I was always under the impression that it may take several years, but recently I watched a Chinese children TV series and was surprised that even the 3somewhat-year-olds were already (apparently) distinguishing tone.
What led you to this impression?
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