Random phonology/phonemic inventory thread [2011–2018]

[Man in Space]

/p t k/
/h~s~ʃ~xʷ/
/d~ð~n/

/i u ə æ ɒ/

˥ ˦ ˧ ˨ ˩ ˥˧ ˦˥ ˨˩ ˩˧ ˥˧˦ ˧˩˨ ˦˥˧ ˩˨˩


Allophony: Word initially, the fricative is [h]. before a front vowel it's ʃ. Before a rounded back vowel it's xʷ and in the presence of a schwa it's .

/d~ð~n/ is [d] word initially, [ð] medially, [n] finally and is the only permitted coda

Taking inspiration from Iau?

[Shemtov]

Yup.

[Shemtov]

/p t̪ t ʈ k/
/t͡ʃ tɬ ʈʂ ʈɬ̢/
/m n̪ n ɳ ŋ/
/ʋ j/

/i i: u u: e o a a:/


Intervocally, the stops and fricatives have the following allophones:
[β ð r ɻ ɣ]
[ʃ ɬ ʐ ɬ̢]

[zyma]

Sometimes, words that (to the best of my knowledge) have no meaning pop into my head. One day while I was working, two words came to me. To someone like me who doesn't speak Mandarin, they sounded a bit like Sinitic words. The words were /t͡ɕiɑ̯ŋ t͡ʃɑʊ̯miŋ/, and I've decided to base a phonology on those words. The phonology, especially the diphthongs, is heavily based on Mandarin, but I think I'll want this language to morphosyntactically be very different from Mandarin and related languages.

/p t k/ p t k
/s ʃ ʐ ɕ x/ s sh r x h
/t͡s t͡ʃ t͡ɕ/ c ch q
/m n ŋ/ m n ng
/j w/ y w
/l/ l

/i e/ i e
/ä/ ä
/u o ɑ/ u o a

/iä̯ iɑ̯ iɑ̯ʊ̯/ iä ia iao
/äɪ̯/ äe
/uä̯ uä̯ɪ̯ uɑ̯ ɑʊ̯/ uä uäe ua ao

Phonotactics: (C)V(N)

C = any non-nasal consonant
V = any vowel or diphthong
N = any nasal

Nasals may occasionally appear in the onset of a syllable word-medially.

/j/ cannot appear before /i iä̯ iɑ̯ iɑ̯ʊ̯ äɪ̯/. Similarly, /w/ cannot appear before /u uä̯ uä̯ɪ̯ uɑ̯ ɑʊ̯/.

Allophony and other such topics:

/ʐ/ is sometimes more of a sonorant than a fricative. As a sonorant, it can surface as [ɻ] before front vowels and [ɽ] before diphthongs beginning with low vowels. Elsewhere, it is usually a fricative. Occasionally, it is [ʂ] or [ʐ̊] word-initially.

/l/ may become [ɺ] after consonants and in the onsets of syllables with back vowel/diphthong nuclei.

/x/ may become an affricate before front and central vowels and diphthongs.

/ä/ often becomes [æ], especially when part of a diphthong with a front vowel and after sibilants.

/i e u o/ may become [ɪ ɛ ʊ ɔ] in closed syllables.


Examples:

qiang /t͡ɕiɑ̯ŋ/
chaoming /t͡ʃɑʊ̯miŋ/
yuäekuan /juä̯ɪ̯kuɑ̯n/

[Ambrisio]

/t͡ɕiɑ̯ŋ t͡ʃɑʊ̯miŋ/

A quick Google search tells me that both Qiang and Chaoming are common Chinese first names.

[zyx3166]

Consonants:
/p t c k p' t' c' k' pʰ tʰ cʰ kʰ ɓ~m ɗ~n f s ç x ɬ ʀ ˀʀ r ˀr w ˀw j ˀj/
Vowels:
/a e ø i ɤ o u/
Allophony:
Nasals are pronounced as implosives before a vowel.

I came up with this after a (failed) attempt to combine as many rare WALS features as possible. But as yet I haven't find an enough satisfactory one.

[Dezinaa]

A thing with no defined syllable structure.

/m n ŋ/ <m n ƞ>
/p pʰ t tʰ k kʰ ʔ/ <b p d t g k ’>
/f v s z x ɣ h/ <f v s z x y h>
/r l j w/ <r l j w>
/i iː u uː e eː o oː a aː/ <i ī u ū e ē o ō a ā>

/mzeːʔopk iːʔnsɣpiruː tʰkʰj ŋph ltʰswpxaː uiɣt mmpahjaː ʔno/
Mzē’obg ī’nsybirū tkj ƞbh ltswbxā uiyd mmbahjā ’no.

[ə] might be inserted in difficult consonant clusters.
/m n ŋ v z ɣ r l j w/ become syllabic in difficult consonant clusters.
By "difficult" I mean clusters that break the sonority hierarchy.

Edit: I wonder what a creole of this and ’iiƞìm would have for its phonology...?

[zyma]

/t͡ɕiɑ̯ŋ t͡ʃɑʊ̯miŋ/

A quick Google search tells me that both Qiang and Chaoming are common Chinese first names.

Hmm, interesting. I've never known of anyone with either name.

[zyma]

A thing with no defined syllable structure.

/m n ŋ/ <m n ƞ>
/p pʰ t tʰ k kʰ ʔ/ <b p d t g k ’>
/f v s z x ɣ h/ <f v s z x y h>
/r l j w/ <r l j w>
/i iː u uː e eː o oː a aː/ <i ī u ū e ē o ō a ā>

/mzeːʔopk iːʔnsɣpiruː tʰkʰj ŋph ltʰswpxaː uiɣt mmpahjaː ʔno/
Mzē’obg ī’nsybirū tkj ƞbh ltswbxā uiyd mmbahjā ’no.

[ə] might be inserted in difficult consonant clusters.
/m n ŋ v z ɣ r l j w/ become syllabic in difficult consonant clusters.
By "difficult" I mean clusters that break the sonority hierarchy.

Edit: I wonder what a creole of this and ’iiƞìm would have for its phonology...?

I'm interested to see what you come up with if you decide to further pursue your creole idea!

[DesEsseintes]

Something based on a gleb-generated phonology I liked. The vowels are based on proto-Vietic.

/m̥ m n̥ n n̥ʷ nʷ n̥ʲ nʲ/
/pʰ p b tʰ t d t͡ɕʰ t͡ɕ d͡ʑ kʰ k g kʷʰ kʷ gʷ qʰ q qʷʰ qʷ/
/ɸ β s z ɕ ʑ/
/l̥ l l̥ʷ lʷ/

/i iə ɨ ɨə u uə/
/e eː ə o oː/
/a aː/

[eldin raigmore]

gleb?

[DesEsseintes]

gleb?

gleb.

[zyma]

I'm not entirely sure where this idea came from, but there's definitely influence from some of the languages of Africa and India.

/p pʰ pː pːʰ b bʱ t tʰ tː tːʰ d dʱ k kʰ kː kːʰ g gʱ/ p ph pp pph b bh t th tt tth d dh k kh kk kkh g gh
/s ʂ h/ s ş h
/m n ŋ/ m n ŋ
/ʋ j/ v y
/ɽ͡r/ r
/l/ l
/ʘ ᵍʘ ʘ͡χ/ w q x

/i iː e eː ɛ ɛː/ i ii e ee ɛ ɛɛ
/a aː/ a aa
/u uː o oː ɔ ɔː/ u uu o oo ɔ ɔɔ

/˧ ˥ ˩/ a á à

The tone diacritics are applied to whatever vowel is carrying tone. There are no contours; long vowels can only be one of three tones, just like short vowels.

Phonotactics: (C)VT(N)

C = any consonant other than a nasal
V = any vowel
T = any tone
N = any fricative, sonorant, or click

Allophony and such:

Aspirated stops can sometimes be pronounced as fricatives. Geminate aspirated stops can be pronounced as affricates.

Coda nasals may prenasalize following stops.

The clicks are definitely subject to change. I'm not sure if I want to add more POAs, MOAs, or both, and if so, which ones? I know that I want at least one pulmonic-contour click.


Examples:

antthin /an˧tːʰin˧/
wɔ́ɔ́şarèl /ʘɔːş˥aɽ͡r˧el˩/
yòvşɛɛ /joʋ˩ʂɛː˧/

[DesEsseintes]

antthin /an˧tːʰin˧/
wɔ́ɔ́şarèl /ʘɔːş˥aɽ͡r˧el˩/
yòvşɛɛ /joʋ˩ʂɛː˧/

These look nice, although I would get rid of the clicks if it were my inventory. Looking at it makes me want to do sth Dravidianesque.

---

I wonder how far I could get with this 8-phoneme inventory...

/n t s~ʃ~ɕ h l/
/a i u/
- high and low tone

(C)V(C)(C)

First few allophony ideas:
/au/ [oʊ̯]
/aau/ [aʊ̯ː]
/ai/ [eɪ̯]
/aai/ [aɪ̯ː]
u → w / #_a, a_a
i → j / #_a, a_a
Excrescent [t] is inserted in a sequence of any two of /n s~ʃ~ɕ l/, so /nl/ [ntl], etc.

[Dezinaa]

A thing with no defined syllable structure.

/m n ŋ/ <m n ƞ>
/p pʰ t tʰ k kʰ ʔ/ <b p d t g k ’>
/f v s z x ɣ h/ <f v s z x y h>
/r l j w/ <r l j w>
/i iː u uː e eː o oː a aː/ <i ī u ū e ē o ō a ā>

/mzeːʔopk iːʔnsɣpiruː tʰkʰj ŋph ltʰswpxaː uiɣt mmpahjaː ʔno/
Mzē’obg ī’nsybirū tkj ƞbh ltswbxā uiyd mmbahjā ’no.

[ə] might be inserted in difficult consonant clusters.
/m n ŋ v z ɣ r l j w/ become syllabic in difficult consonant clusters.
By "difficult" I mean clusters that break the sonority hierarchy.

Edit: I wonder what a creole of this and ’iiƞìm would have for its phonology...?

I'm interested to see what you come up with if you decide to further pursue your creole idea!

Thanks!

Here's what I tentatively have for the creole, which I'm calling Tkáávante for now.

/m n ŋ/ <m n ƞ>
/p t k ʔ/ <p t k ’>
/v ɾ ɣ h/ <v r y h>
/j w/ <j w>
/i u a/ <i u a>
/iː uː eː oː aː/ <ii uu e o aa> (There are no short /e/ or /o/.)
/á à/ <í ú é ó á, i u e o a>

Syllable structure: (F)/(N/P)(N/P)(A)V(N/P)(N/P), where F = fricative, N = nasal, P = plosive, and A = approximant.
Note that /ɾ/ acts like a fricative.

[zyma]

These look nice, although I would get rid of the clicks if it were my inventory. Looking at it makes me want to do sth Dravidianesque.

Thanks! Yeah, I was thinking the same thing. Nothing I did with the clicks seemed to help them fit this inventory, so I'm going to remove them. You should definitely make something based on Dravidian languages!

I like the 8-phoneme idea as well. Are /s~ʃ~ɕ/ in completely free variation, or are certain realizations more likely to appear in certain environments?

---

Here's what I tentatively have for the creole, which I'm calling Tkáávante for now.

Nice! I especially like that /ɾ/ patterns with the fricatives.

---

Updated version of the last inventory I posted, sans clicks.

/p pʰ pː pːʰ b bʱ t tʰ tː tːʰ d dʱ k kʰ kː kːʰ g gʱ/ p ph pp pph b bh t th tt tth d dh k kh kk kkh g gh
/s ʂ h/ s ş h
/m n ŋ/ m n ŋ
/ʋ j/ v y
/ɽ͡r/ r
/l/ l

/i iː e eː ɛ ɛː/ i ii e ee ɛ ɛɛ
/a aː/ a aa
/u uː o oː ɔ ɔː/ u uu o oo ɔ ɔɔ

/˧ ˥ ˩/ a á à

The tone diacritics are applied to whatever vowel is carrying tone. There are no contours; long vowels can only be one of three tones, just like short vowels.

Phonotactics: (C)VT(N)

C = any consonant other than a nasal
V = any vowel
T = any tone
N = any fricative or sonorant

I'm not 100% sure about forbidding onset nasals. I might end up allowing /m n/ or just /n/ in onsets rarely.

Allophony and such:

Aspirated stops can sometimes be pronounced as fricatives. Geminate aspirated stops can be pronounced as affricates.

Coda nasals may prenasalize following stops.


Examples:

antthin /an˧tːʰin˧/
vɔ́ɔ́şarèl /ʋɔːş˥aɽ͡r˧el˩/
yòvşɛɛ /joʋ˩ʂɛː˧/

[DesEsseintes]

I'm not 100% sure about forbidding onset nasals. I might end up allowing /m n/ or just /n/ in onsets rarely.

It would certainly have a huge effect on the sound of the language! I say keep it if you can, even though I'm fully aware that I myself would be unable to stick to it.

/iː uː eː oː aː/ <ii uu e o aa> (There are no short /e/ or /o/.)

Sounds about right!

I like the 8-phoneme idea as well. Are /s~ʃ~ɕ/ in completely free variation, or are certain realizations more likely to appear in certain environments?

Thanks! Originally I wanted just /ʃ/ but then I thought that might be a bit unnatural in a language with no other sibilants and such few phonemes so I threw in the free variation. Now I'm thinking sth along the lines of

s~ʂ / a_a
ɕ / i_i (or V_i?)
ʃ / else

[zyma]

It would certainly have a huge effect on the sound of the language! I say keep it if you can, even though I'm fully aware that I myself would be unable to stick to it.

I know what you mean about it being hard to stick to. I will try to keep that restriction in for now, though.

Thanks! Originally I wanted just /ʃ/ but then I thought that might be a bit unnatural in a language with no other sibilants and such few phonemes so I threw in the free variation. Now I'm thinking sth along the lines of

s~ʂ / a_a
ɕ / i_i (or V_i?)
ʃ / else

That's true; /s/ does seem to be the most likely phoneme to be not only the lone sibilant, but occasionally the lone fricative of an inventory.

I'd suggest something like:

s~ʂ / V̀_a
ɕ / V_i, V́_V́
ʃ / elsewhere

V = any vowel, regardless of tone
V́ = any high tone vowel
V̀ = any low tone vowel


But that's just me.

[DesEsseintes]

I'd suggest something like:

s~ʂ / V̀_a
ɕ / V_i, V́_V́
ʃ / elsewhere

V = any vowel, regardless of tone
V́ = any high tone vowel
V̀ = any low tone vowel

Interesting! I hadn't thought of having tone affect the realisation. I'll have to think about this.

[Dezinaa]

/iː uː eː oː aː/ <ii uu e o aa> (There are no short /e/ or /o/.)

Sounds about right!

My alter ego is Captain Obvious.

You didn't see anything... *disappears*