From what I remember, it uses the order of nouns (or maybe just arguments?) to mark hierarchy in a gender system. Higher ranking nouns have to come before lower ranking ones. It's mostly about animacy, but there's twelve different ranks, and the highest rank being reserved deities and lightning, I think? Someone with a better memory or knowledge might have to correct me.
(L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
- LinguoFranco
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
Would anyone here know anything about the Papuan language, Imonda?
From what I read it has a topic-comment system, and I'm curious how it compares to languages like Japanese in that area? Can't find too many good resources, though.
From what I read it has a topic-comment system, and I'm curious how it compares to languages like Japanese in that area? Can't find too many good resources, though.
- Creyeditor
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
Sorry, I don't know anything about this specific language. My guess is that there are many more topic-prominent lamguages in the macroarea.
Creyeditor
"Thoughts are free."
Produce, Analyze, Manipulate
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Ook & Omlűt & Nautli languages & Sperenjas
Papuan languages, Morphophonology, Lexical Semantics
"Thoughts are free."
Produce, Analyze, Manipulate
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Ook & Omlűt & Nautli languages & Sperenjas
Papuan languages, Morphophonology, Lexical Semantics
- VaptuantaDoi
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
Here's a grammar of Imonda. I haven't read it but it looks OK.
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
Have I elevated Zareian (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1jgS ... VO4E0/edit), a language from my Ultraman/Godzilla Fanfiction world, past being just a relex, or is it still not a true conlang?
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
What are the differences between sani and had?
Also, by the A in "ask", do you mean /a/, the vowel in the song "Alouette", halfway in between the A in "cat" and the A in "party"?
Also, by the A in "ask", do you mean /a/, the vowel in the song "Alouette", halfway in between the A in "cat" and the A in "party"?
♂♥♂♀
Squirrels chase koi . . . chase squirrels
My Kankonian-English dictionary: 91,592 words and counting
31,416: The number of the conlanging beast!
Squirrels chase koi . . . chase squirrels
My Kankonian-English dictionary: 91,592 words and counting
31,416: The number of the conlanging beast!
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
There is no difference between sani and had. Thank you very much for pointing that out, as that one completely slipped past me.Khemehekis wrote: ↑20 Apr 2024 12:49 What are the differences between sani and had?
Also, by the A in "ask", do you mean /a/, the vowel in the song "Alouette", halfway in between the A in "cat" and the A in "party"?
As for your other question, the answer is no. The Zareian letter Agra is not pronounced, though it probably would be in some dialects, as /a/. It’s closer to /æ/.
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
You're welcome, but why not keep the two words for "be" and use them for different meanings? "Be" can mean:GodzillaLouise wrote: ↑20 Apr 2024 13:27There is no difference between sani and had. Thank you very much for pointing that out, as that one completely slipped past me.Khemehekis wrote: ↑20 Apr 2024 12:49 What are the differences between sani and had?
Also, by the A in "ask", do you mean /a/, the vowel in the song "Alouette", halfway in between the A in "cat" and the A in "party"?
1. Describing things.
1a. Inherent characteristics: Kate is beautiful.
1b. States: This soup is hot right now.
2. Indicating that subject and predicate noun are the same: Hi, I'm Jim.
3. Indicating that one thing is a subset of another: Zach is a boy.
4. Indicating location: It is on the table.
5. Equals: Two plus two is four.
6. Marking passive voice: All the hot dogs were eaten.
7. Indicating present progressive or imperfect: Jennifer is smiling. Tom was munching on a pizza.
8. Describing visiting a place: I've never been to India.
9. Indicating role-playing: I be He-man, you be She-ra.
"Ask" has /a/ for me (and I also know many people in West Contra Costa who say /æks/!). Why not use a word like "apple" or "add" for /æ/?As for your other question, the answer is no. The Zareian letter Agra is not pronounced, though it probably would be in some dialects, as /a/. It’s closer to /æ/.
♂♥♂♀
Squirrels chase koi . . . chase squirrels
My Kankonian-English dictionary: 91,592 words and counting
31,416: The number of the conlanging beast!
Squirrels chase koi . . . chase squirrels
My Kankonian-English dictionary: 91,592 words and counting
31,416: The number of the conlanging beast!
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
Both of these are good points. To the first one, I will admit that it’d be a bit… interesting with the table setup I have currently, but it is possible to make the table set up clearer as to what meanings the Zareian words are used to convey, and thus allow for both ‘had’ and ‘sani’ to mean ‘be’. I don’t really know how to do so, but it is possible. To the second one, I can definitely change it out for apple or add.Khemehekis wrote: ↑20 Apr 2024 14:09You're welcome, but why not keep the two words for "be" and use them for different meanings? "Be" can mean:GodzillaLouise wrote: ↑20 Apr 2024 13:27There is no difference between sani and had. Thank you very much for pointing that out, as that one completely slipped past me.Khemehekis wrote: ↑20 Apr 2024 12:49 What are the differences between sani and had?
Also, by the A in "ask", do you mean /a/, the vowel in the song "Alouette", halfway in between the A in "cat" and the A in "party"?
1. Describing things.
1a. Inherent characteristics: Kate is beautiful.
1b. States: This soup is hot right now.
2. Indicating that subject and predicate noun are the same: Hi, I'm Jim.
3. Indicating that one thing is a subset of another: Zach is a boy.
4. Indicating location: It is on the table.
5. Equals: Two plus two is four.
6. Marking passive voice: All the hot dogs were eaten.
7. Indicating present progressive or imperfect: Jennifer is smiling. Tom was munching on a pizza.
8. Describing visiting a place: I've never been to India.
9. Indicating role-playing: I be He-man, you be She-ra.
"Ask" has /a/ for me (and I also know many people in West Contra Costa who say /æks/!). Why not use a word like "apple" or "add" for /æ/?As for your other question, the answer is no. The Zareian letter Agra is not pronounced, though it probably would be in some dialects, as /a/. It’s closer to /æ/.
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
Anyway, my initial question still stands: has Zareian been elevated to the status of a true conlang?
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
Definitely look into how that works. It's necessary for a good table dictionary! Lots of English words have multiple, semantically unrelated meanings that would almost certainly be different words in unrelated languages. You have the word zyai for "throw" in your verbs list, I see. I'm guessing that's "throw" like throwing a ball. OK, what verb would you use for throwing a party? And what about the verbal ifiom "throw up", meaning to vomit? Do you have a separate verb that means "to vomit", "to throw up", "to puke", "to barf", etc.? Or maybe you can make zyai also mean "throw up", without Zareian having to put a prepositional adverb at the end the way English does. What about "throw away"? What about "throw" like when something catches you offguard and confuses you?GodzillaLouise wrote: ↑20 Apr 2024 14:40 To the first one, I will admit that it’d be a bit… interesting with the table setup I have currently, but it is possible to make the table set up clearer as to what meanings the Zareian words are used to convey, and thus allow for both ‘had’ and ‘sani’ to mean ‘be’. I don’t really know how to do so, but it is possible.
Then there's the verb "to run". As you see in this translation exercise I did, "run" in English can mean a lot of things. In some languages, no two of these sentences would use the same verb!
Having your table cover distinctions in word meaning is also useful for things like kinship terms. Take the words "brother" and "sister", for instance. In English, we just have the words "sister", "brother", and "sibling". In Bengali, they have a separate word for "older brother" and "younger brother", and a separate word for "older sister" and "younger sister".
Then there's Japanese! In Japanese, they make distinctions for gender AND age AND for whether you're talking about your own sibling, or someone else's sibling. My older brother is anii, your/his/her else's older brother is oniisan, my older sister is anee, your/his/her older sister is oneesan, my younger brother is otooto, your/his/her younger brother is otootosan, my younger sister is imooto, and your/his/her younger sister is imootosan. And kyuudai means "sibling(s)" in general.
In some indigenous languages of Latin America, one word would be used for the brother of a brother, and another word would be used for the brother of a sister. A third word would mean the sister of a brother, and a fourth word would mean the sister of a sister!
Then there are some languages (I think Pacific Islander languages) wherein there are two words for siblings: one word means a brother's brother or a sister's sister, and the other word means a sister's brother or a brother's sister.
Or maybe you have only one word with no gender nor age distinctions: sibling!
In Qatama, a conlang created by Masako, the word for "brother" is the same as the word for a male cousin, and the word for "sister" is the same as a word for a female cousin. You might want to try something like that.
In some languages, the word for "boy" is the same as the word for "son", and the word for "girl" is the same as the word for "daughter" (think of the French fille). You could also make "man" and "husband" and/or "woman" and "wife" the same word. (In Russian, the word for "boy/young man/lad" is the same as the word for "boyfriend", and the word for "girl/young woman/lass" is the same as the word for "girlfriend").
As you see, the English verbs "be", "throw", and "run" have many meanings. The words in your conlang will often be like that too. In my conlang, Kankonian, a*utzki (the * is a velar lateral) has the meaning "to fill", as in "Jake filled the bottle". But it can also mean:
*To do/to suffice: I think two more sprays will do.
*To strike: Inspiration strikes!
*To stuff: Starve a fever, stuff a cold.
*In the passive voice, a*utzkiiz, the verb means "to fill up", as in "The Mandarin class is filling up quickly".
Like "throw up" and "throw away", it can be used in verbal idioms:
a*uztki shampa na veziri ad: to be a jerk about (literally "to fill the role of a jerk to")
a*utzki shampa na lotkar: to go along for the ride (literally "to fill the role of the rider")
a*utzki noshyas: to clue [someone] in (lit. "to fill clues")
a*utzki bwolwu na o na: to get a load of (lit. "to fill one's eyes with")
a*utzki na khour: to hit the spot (lit. "to fill with beer")
And then there's:
phutelo ad a*utzki: a mouth to feed (lit. "a stomach to fill")
And a*utzki can be a noun, too: it can mean "round", as in "Jeff used up three rounds of bullets".
BTW, maybe I missed this, but I haven't seen how to do passive voice! Like if you wanted to say "The reporter was arrested by the cop" instead of "The cop arrested the reporter".
♂♥♂♀
Squirrels chase koi . . . chase squirrels
My Kankonian-English dictionary: 91,592 words and counting
31,416: The number of the conlanging beast!
Squirrels chase koi . . . chase squirrels
My Kankonian-English dictionary: 91,592 words and counting
31,416: The number of the conlanging beast!
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
Not gonna lie, that’s not what I meant. I see your point, and it does make a lot of sense. I can do that, yes, but figuring out how to make the table look has been difficult, and that’s something that needs to be done first for me. I want to keep the design simple, but I also want to make it so that it’s clear that this additional row on the table is there to help distinguish word meanings.Khemehekis wrote: ↑20 Apr 2024 23:33Definitely look into how that works. It's necessary for a good table dictionary! Lots of English words have multiple, semantically unrelated meanings that would almost certainly be different words in unrelated languages.GodzillaLouise wrote: ↑20 Apr 2024 14:40 To the first one, I will admit that it’d be a bit… interesting with the table setup I have currently, but it is possible to make the table set up clearer as to what meanings the Zareian words are used to convey, and thus allow for both ‘had’ and ‘sani’ to mean ‘be’. I don’t really know how to do so, but it is possible.
And yes, it’d have to be an additional row, the problem is just that I want to stop it from getting too narrow in the Google Docs print view: if you have to view on mobile to read everything effectively, that’s a problem.
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
Then as I post that edit… I realize a potential solution by looking at the previous sentences… putting a bulleted list in the additional row + changing the page setup to a wider one. Sorry if this seems redundant, it might be. I’m just letting you know I don’t believe I need help figuring out how to make my table distinguish between word meanings of the same word anymore, so it probably is. Anyway, I’ll get to it. Will ask the question again when I have that all done. Probably will be in a few days, though.GodzillaLouise wrote: ↑21 Apr 2024 00:16Not gonna lie, that’s not what I meant. I see your point, and it does make a lot of sense. I can do that, yes, but figuring out how to make the table look has been difficult, and that’s something that needs to be done first for me. I want to keep the design simple, but I also want to make it so that it’s clear that this additional row on the table is there to help distinguish word meanings.Khemehekis wrote: ↑20 Apr 2024 23:33Definitely look into how that works. It's necessary for a good table dictionary! Lots of English words have multiple, semantically unrelated meanings that would almost certainly be different words in unrelated languages.GodzillaLouise wrote: ↑20 Apr 2024 14:40 To the first one, I will admit that it’d be a bit… interesting with the table setup I have currently, but it is possible to make the table set up clearer as to what meanings the Zareian words are used to convey, and thus allow for both ‘had’ and ‘sani’ to mean ‘be’. I don’t really know how to do so, but it is possible.
And yes, it’d have to be an additional row, the problem is just that I want to stop it from getting too narrow in the Google Docs print view: if you have to view on mobile to read everything effectively, that’s a problem.
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
Glad to've been of help!GodzillaLouise wrote: ↑21 Apr 2024 00:26 I realize a potential solution by looking at the previous sentences… putting a bulleted list in the additional row + changing the page setup to a wider one.
♂♥♂♀
Squirrels chase koi . . . chase squirrels
My Kankonian-English dictionary: 91,592 words and counting
31,416: The number of the conlanging beast!
Squirrels chase koi . . . chase squirrels
My Kankonian-English dictionary: 91,592 words and counting
31,416: The number of the conlanging beast!
- LinguoFranco
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
I don't remember if I've asked this already or not, but can anyone tell me about how topic-prominence works in Imonda?
I'm just really curious how a topic prominent language works outside of Asia.
I'm just really curious how a topic prominent language works outside of Asia.
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
Here's a good post on it:LinguoFranco wrote: ↑02 May 2024 20:30 I don't remember if I've asked this already or not, but can anyone tell me about how topic-prominence works in Imonda?
I'm just really curious how a topic prominent language works outside of Asia.
https://cbbforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=32 ... da#p329472
♂♥♂♀
Squirrels chase koi . . . chase squirrels
My Kankonian-English dictionary: 91,592 words and counting
31,416: The number of the conlanging beast!
Squirrels chase koi . . . chase squirrels
My Kankonian-English dictionary: 91,592 words and counting
31,416: The number of the conlanging beast!
- Arayaz
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
LinguoFranco wrote: ↑02 May 2024 20:30 I don't remember if I've asked this already or not, but can anyone tell me about how topic-prominence works in Imonda?
I'm just really curious how a topic prominent language works outside of Asia.
That grammar's section on topic is very annoying to read for several reasons, but from what I can tell, it seems that the topic marker can be applied to any noun, verb, or adverb in the sentence, and has a lot of grammatical/syntactical use in subordinate clauses (but can also kinda just provide focus on a certain element, as the normal usage of a topic). It seems like it can also be used to string together multiple clauses with emphasis of some kind:Khemehekis wrote: ↑03 May 2024 00:34Here's a good post on it:
https://cbbforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=32 ... da#p329472
This is just from a quick glance, mind you.Ièfia puhõ. Puhõnaba saihõ. Saihõnaba õnõ ...
house-LOC arrive / arrive-PST-TOP enter / enter-PST-TOP say-PST-D ...
"He arrived at the house. Having arrived, he entered. Having entered, he said ...
Proud member of the myopic-trans-southerner-Viossa-girl-with-two-cats-who-joined-on-September-6th-2022 gang
2c2ef0 Areyaxi family Arskiilz Kahóra Xúuuatxia Alushi
my garbage Ɛĭ3
she/her
2c2ef0 Areyaxi family Arskiilz Kahóra Xúuuatxia Alushi
my garbage Ɛĭ3
she/her
- LinguoFranco
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Re: (L&N) Q&A Thread - Quick questions go here
I find it interesting that the topic marker can go with any word. I'm no expert, but I think in Japanese, Korean, and Chinese, the topic marker is restricted to nouns, isn't it?Arayaz wrote: ↑03 May 2024 00:49LinguoFranco wrote: ↑02 May 2024 20:30 I don't remember if I've asked this already or not, but can anyone tell me about how topic-prominence works in Imonda?
I'm just really curious how a topic prominent language works outside of Asia.That grammar's section on topic is very annoying to read for several reasons, but from what I can tell, it seems that the topic marker can be applied to any noun, verb, or adverb in the sentence, and has a lot of grammatical/syntactical use in subordinate clauses (but can also kinda just provide focus on a certain element, as the normal usage of a topic). It seems like it can also be used to string together multiple clauses with emphasis of some kind:Khemehekis wrote: ↑03 May 2024 00:34Here's a good post on it:
https://cbbforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=32 ... da#p329472This is just from a quick glance, mind you.Ièfia puhõ. Puhõnaba saihõ. Saihõnaba õnõ ...
house-LOC arrive / arrive-PST-TOP enter / enter-PST-TOP say-PST-D ...
"He arrived at the house. Having arrived, he entered. Having entered, he said ...